12 Things Standing Between You and a Great Website

Flashing rainbow type, can I p- still keep that on my website? Is that- If you wanna do that, then you can do that ... does that cause more weight, though? Like, if I were to do that? Or is that- I mean, slightly more than, than... I mean, we're talking micro. What if I had a drop shadow under that type? You really just...

We're getting back to the, um, do no harm, uh- Sorry, yeah ... point of things. I said as this is very painful to even try to visualize.

Welcome to the Marketing Team of One podcast, where we have conversations about the issues one-person marketing teams face when trying to meet their goals with limited time and budgets. Now here's your hosts, Eric and Mike. Mike. Eric. Hi. Here we sit. We did it. You're on the crying couch. Yep. You're not crying today, though.

No. Or are you? No. Depends. Well, you're, usually there's tears on the very bri- It's- You're on the brink of tears most of the time ... it's touch and go most of the time. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So that works. I, we could probably both sit there- ... maybe this week. I don't know. That'd be tough, though. It wouldn't look so good on camera.

Today we're gonna talk about building a perfect website. Perfection is elusive. I, it may not be possible. Mm. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. But after this podcast, we're just gonna hope people can get a little bit closer to building that perfect website. Yeah. And this would apply to any size scale website, right? Mm-hmm. Yeah, I think almost down to a single page, but also a, a full website.

Um, full website being hundreds of pages, you know? Amazon.com. Yeah. There's a lot of the considerations that, of all the things you need to think about- Okay ... uh, on, for a perfect, perfect website- Perfect ... um, would apply- So- ... on to everything ... just to bring up perfect and the idea of perfect in the website world, I, this just gets us to a level where, I mean, perfect includes a lot of different factors.

Is this gonna be something that we're gonna be talking about, like design and pictures and color and things like that? Or is it just like wrenching on, you know, well, the suspension's gonna need to be fine-tuned, and then the, then there's spark plugs need to be adj- Like, that kind of talk? What are we talking as far as what's making it perfect?

Well, you're an F1 fan. Love it. Yep. Mercedes. Yep. Total. Yep. So that, that F1 car- Hmm. Okay ... is, it, that's, uh, perfection, right? It has to be perfection, right? Absolutely. Absolutely. Does, uh, does the labeling on the outside, is that what makes it perfect? Hmm. Well, as a designer, of course, I do judge that, but no.

No. It's usually, that's not why I'm watching. Yeah. Yeah. There's, how big's the team, uh- Hmm ... managing that, like the build and the maintenance and all that other? Sometimes it's over 1,000 people. Websites aren't that complicated. I don't wanna over-inflate that a little bit. Yeah. But I think, like, I think des- when you're talking about, like, design and graphics or, like, uh, you know, tuning or wrenching on it, those are only two of, like, you know, 12 different, like- There's a lot of levers

considerations. There's a lot of things- Okay ... that I think go into it. I, it, in my low moments, I just think about, like, how hard it is- Yeah ... to actually build, uh, a webpage or a website that checks all the boxes. It's like, because it's such a random set of skills, um, and requirements that all have to come together- Yeah

to really kind of build things. And it's- For one person, it's probably very, very hard to do. And so I just wanted to kind of point those out and just say, like, the, you know, like, I don't think most sites get all of these things right. It's kind of a sliding scale on a lot of these different things. But, uh, there's so many different considerations, and so, um- So when-

just having a webpage, um- Is not ... is not... It might not be enough. It's optimizing the webpage for all of the things that you need this webpage to work for. Work- that's what this, that's what we're gonna talk about today. Yeah. Um, maybe not so much optimization, but there, I, I see it as considerations- Yeah

and things you need to pay attention to to have what I would say is a successful and compliant and, um- Yeah, website. This is a g- So we're giving up people a level set if they reach the perfection of all of these. You've given me 12 bullet points to go through. Yes. Okay. So we're gonna- It's a lot. It's a lot.

This is, we're gonna try to make it quick. We're not gonna- Yeah ... have you sit here for three hours- Yeah ... watching a podcast. Yes. As much as you'd probably love to do. I don't want it to be as dizzying for everybody as it can be for others who o- or think about all these things all the time. Okay. Uh, yeah. I want it to be- These are the, these are the things that you check a box on and look at when you're judging and helping our clients understand what they need to, uh, keep their eyes on when they're building a website.

Yes. I might have high standards, but I, when I consider, like, what we're doing to build this website right- Yeah ... these are the areas that I look at. So of course, we're gonna start off with my favorite phrase of the podcast. Well, there's so many, but this would be one of my favorites. Yeah. And I think it's a top 10 hit if we were to do that.

Might be a future episode. Um, know your audience. Correct? Correct. Do we wanna start there? I think you have to start there because if you're not, you're, it's not, it, like, this is the, this is your North Star for- Mm-hmm ... everything else you're doing, right? I think you have to know that what you're doing here is not, in most cases, is not for you.

You're not building this website p- for you. Mm-hmm. I mean, if it's a personal thing, sure. Right. Well, if it's for- But for, for most- Yeah ... but if it's for commerce or communication or something like that, you're building that for other people. Right. And you have to keep those people in mind. And so everything else that you do past that, um, should be, we should keep that in mind.

You have to, you have to be considering your users first. So we're gonna make a list first, and we're gonna put on there maybe the top three things that this website does for your organization or company, and then we're gonna put a hierarchy on those three things and make sure that we hit all three of those ideally as perfect as we possibly can.

Is it three? Is it one? Is it, am I s- speaking out of turn as far as, like, when we identify the goals of the website and the t- terms from how our audience is looking and experiencing the website? Or is it just one goal? Stick to that. I think it's a mindset. Oh, interesting. I don't think it's a, a list of checkboxes and stuff like that.

It's a mindset. You have to be thinking about this, the, this isn't for me. Yes, partially for me. Yes. But is, but in order to be a success for me, I have to be thinking about- Who are the people this is for? Okay. So first- That's just an overall mindset thing. Overall mind- Yeah ... set your mind correctly before you set- Yep

down to build this website. Yep. All right. So then the next thing that I see on this list is copywriting, words. Words. Words. Copywriting for websites is, I don't think it's an easy thing. I think a lot of people think, oh, I could just, you know, I, I write emails. I know I can write. Sure. I'll, I'll, I'll write this thing.

But there's a- Or a birthday card, yeah ... there's a structure, there's a flow, there's a brevity, there's a clarity- Mm ... that's super important for any pages, any time you're trying to communicate something. Too brief, you don't give enough information to be helpful. Too long, you bore people, they're not even gonna read it, right?

So, like, the copywriting, um, has to be, in almost in all cases, trying to be as succinct as possible and, um, and focused on the person who- And, and there could be slight levels of hierarchy if you do, if you, let's say it's a scientific type of a website. Yes, the people are going there to learn something- Yes

and they wanna do a heavy dive into something. You don't put that on the homepage, though. No. You put that in a place where- There's a time and a place for everything ... exactly. Yes. So you wanna consider those kind of things. If you do have a lot of information and very technical stuff maybe. Yeah. Maybe, I'm not, don't wanna b- b- bury it, but y- you're gonna have to put that down on the- Yeah

chain a little bit. Yeah. So copywriting is super, uh, like having the skill to maybe not write it- Mm ... but to understand that what's important, uh, to convey, and doing it as concisely as possible is, is very important, I think, for most top-level pages on your site. One of my favorite phrases that I've heard from people is, "I would have wrote you a shorter letter if I had more time."

Yep. 'Cause it takes a lot of time to write- Yes ... not a lot of copy. Exactly. It's brevity and clarity is, is, can be hard, you know? And so, and that's what I think you really need to strive for on, on this perfect webpage or website that we're talking about. All right. Let's move on to the next bullet. Is that- Yep.

Yep ... is that copywriting? Okay. User experience, what does that mean? I don't even know what that means. That means how it looks? What... I don't even know anymore. No. I mean, there's a lot of, and I think there's a lot of things that we're gonna talk, uh, talk about further through the list, and this does kind of bubble up to the o- original thing.

Like- Yeah ... keep your users in mind, i- it not yourself, right? But I think user experience, it, it touches so many different things. The w- Mm ... the writing the, that, that we just talked about is a big part of it. Mm-hmm. Right? Um, the- The look and feel can, you know, help support that user experience. Your navigation between pages- Mm-hmm

where, where you're linking from one page to another. How are you, um... Are you making it as easy as possible for people to use this site that you built? Find the button. Find the navigation. Yeah. How do I go back? How do I go forward? How do I navigate? Are you anticipating their next steps when they're on a page?

Like, you might, like some, some of them, like, like if you're talking about more of like an app-based or some kind of like onboarding sequence, you can, you can walk them through things, and it might be a little bit more prescribed. But for other general things, you may not think there's natural steps, but if you take a step back and you think about the journey that people are taking through there, what are some common next steps that people might wanna do?

You wanna anticipate those needs and make it easier for the people. That brings up a phrase that I've heard you say, journey mapping, where you d- you basically are doing that, where you're- Yeah ... identifying this is the purpose of what this user's gonna come to this website for, and they wanna go through these steps to get to that- Yeah

solution. Yeah. So make a few of those scenarios in your own head, 'cause obviously a website's not just a single purpose thing. No. No. There's multiple purposes, but you wanna identify what all of those goals will be- Mm-hmm ... using that. If you can. If you can. Yep. And then navigate, uh, again. Put a hierarchy on it.

Put, you know... Maybe it's three or four different purposes, you know? And then map those out logically so that it makes sense for those- Mm-hmm ... users. Yep. Yeah. All right. Have we covered user experience? That's... Yeah. Let's, let's keep it... I think a lot of these touch on e- elements of user experience, but- Yeah. I think user experience is kind of another umbrella thing- Yes

that kind of does relate to- Yeah ... most of these, but we're gonna dive deeper into it like we just talked about design. Let's talk about design, Mike. What does design mean on a website? My thinking with design, especially when it comes to webpages and stuff like that, is it should support the message or the communication that you're trying to, to make, right?

Yep. And so y- the design should Help communicate the look and the feel, um, that you wanna convey for your organization. And the- and there's- but you should not let that design get in the way- Mm-hmm ... of comprehension or the message. And so I think too little design and you're not g- it's, it, it's gonna give a kinda meh, so what?

It'll be off brand for one. It could be off brand, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, too much design, it might, it, it, you're, you're probably putting your own, like, stuff ahead of the people that are trying to- The goals that we've just identified ... the goals of the communication. Yeah. Yeah. So, so getting design right and making sure that it is an extension of your brand on the site i- is important.

It, it, um, each site is gonna have a different balance for that. If there's no, like, prescriptive, like- Yeah ... this is the design that you should use. But, um- I'm gonna use the phrase that they use in, um, in the medical industry. Do no harm. Yes. There's a lot of opportunities to do harm with design. Yes. Yes, I've seen a lot of it.

So- Yeah, yeah ... maybe just if, if default decision, just keep that in mind. Absolutely. You know? Yeah. 'Cause default on the side of simplicity. Yes. And there's a lot of reasons, um, on the web too that you would wanna, if, if given the choice between them, you would probably wanna go simpler. Yeah. And we'll get into those or other considerations for this perfect web page.

Oh, a little preview. Yeah. Okay. Very good. Yep. Yeah, I think that, um, a website is an extension of your brand. Think of it that way. It's a deeper dive for your customers or your users to dive deeper into the experience of what it's like to work with you, what it's like to buy your products, and be involved in y- the culture of your organization.

Think in those terms. I don't know if that helps people, but that's kind of what we go through when we just design anything really. Yep. Like I'm thinking of a publication, which is kind of a close analog to what- Mm-hmm ... a website would be. You know, ideally, though, because a website has very chaotic ways of navigating around as opposed to a book where you're flipping from one page to the next- Think in terms of driving people to those purposes in a much more subtle way with visual elements and elements that you already have in your brand.

Yep. Absolutely. All right. Enough about design, right? Let's move on. Let's move on. It's just one of 12, you know? I know. We got a long... We're gonna be here a while. We're only five in. Yeah. Okay, let's talk about accessibility. What does that mean? This is a huge, huge thing. I mean, there's federal mandates on- All that, yes

website accessibility now, and making sure that your website meets requirements, so people who have impaired vision or no vision at all, or motor skill, you know- Mm ... um, um, disabilities, that they can still access the content of your site. And so there's a... That's a deep thing to... And I know we've talked about it in other episodes too.

Mm. But accessibility is a, is a growing concern for a lot of people, especially people who haven't really paid attention to it, and now they're hearing, "Oh, there's federal regulation against it. We need to-" Yeah ... we need to make it accessible. There's a lot, a lot of things that go into it, but so you can't...

I don't think you should ever be building a website that doesn't think about accessibility upfront. And let's just, let's just hit, just really quickly, a list just off the top of the dome here. Color contrast is a big issue sometimes. Yep. Color contrast, um, type sizes. Type sizes. Um, not making them too small.

Okay. As you get older, it's really easy to test things. You just kind of take off your glasses and you read it, and can you... Does it, you know- Right ... that's a good test. Right. And then there's some of the invisible elements to most people that you need to put in there, and that would be like keyboard shortcut, um- Oh

keyboard navigation, so you can get past long menus and get to the content of the page. And there's a lot of other things behind the scenes. Putting labels on images so that the image- Yes ... the reader can explain- If- ... what the photo is. Yes. Using- For people who a- who are using a screen reader for those type- Right

type things. Yeah. Label- labeling images, labeling charts, tables, um, so they, so they get read with the proper descriptions. And one last one Auto-playing video. Just rolls into right of a video or some sort of carouseling features that drive you mental, right? That, I'm not a huge fan. Okay. I, um, but yeah, for accessibility point, you have to have controls to be able to stop and, and, um, and play those things on the page.

So- Uh-huh ... like the, the, the background video that everybody loves to throw in there, right? You have to- Yeah ... you can't just have that be auto-playing. You have to have a way for people to control that, and that's more for, um, motion, people who are motion sensitive to, especially if they're, they don't have control over the motion, that it can, you know- Make them dizzy- Yeah

and, uh, whatever. Yeah. So- Okay. Yep. I don't... Okay. Well, this gets into the same category-ish maybe, the next bullet- Sort of ... bullet point, we're gonna call this compliance. So you have to be compliant when you're ex- making websites ac- accessible. Yeah. But you're speaking, there's other things that fall into this bucket of compliance.

Yeah. So, so I probably could have labeled it a little bit better. Uh-huh. But my, the idea here is that if you're in Europe, if you are in California- Ah, yes ... there's a lot of regulation about like, um, consumer privacy and data, and how you handle that. Got it. Okay. Um, if you collect cookies at all, this is why, if you've used the web at all- Yeah

you've, you're seeing the results of this. You see the pop-up when it says accept, reject, you know, all the different things- Mm-hmm ... to let people know. Um- That's, uh, that's, especially if you're collecting any kind of things. And there, you could be using third party things that you don't necessarily think about are collecting data, but- Mm

but they are. I mean, the, the biggest example is probably Google Analytics, right? Mm. Mm-hmm. If you're using Google Analytics, it's put setting a cookie on your machine so it can track all that stuff. So by default, you pretty much need to put on that accept- Yes ... the fact that you're collecting data, or what's the other?

N- deny? What if people deny? Does that mean they can't look at your website? So this is where, this is where, this is a, this is a tricky one. Because, like, when you're doing that- Yeah ... when you're saying deny, you're turning off the ability for them to set a cookie on your machine. Okay. So you can't just, like, have a notice and then keep doing everything.

You have to have it tied to- Ah ... the actions you're actually- A mechanic. And, yeah. Okay. And with both the GDPR, which is the European standard, and California, um, Consumer Protection Act, they all also have provisions for making it, making it so y- me, as a consumer, I can request from the website owner that you delete my data.

Oh. So you have to be able to go back and be able to- Wow ... remove people any personally identifiable data. Have we ever gotten a call that said, "Hey, get rid of my data," if we've ever done that and they've- Um, no, I don't know that we have, but- Just curious ... but, uh, yeah, I w- I would hope- You have to have the ability

you are ready to do it, you know? So this is a big th- I mean, this is another thing that's just, like, when I think about all the things you have to do on a website, this is one of the ones that just kinda feels a little... Like, if you don't do it already- Yeah ... it can feel daunting. Okay. This brings up the next issue.

Now, I, I'm just gonna break off for a second here and talk about this, because I was just at a conference where somebody was talking about this. And you mentioned fast code and hosting as w- as the next bullet point, so combine those two things. Yeah. Fast code used to be scored by Google, and then your site would get a much higher- Mm-hmm

search thing. Yep. But now that was basically made irrelevant, I think. Like, Google- Oh, really? ... has recently come out, or maybe not even that recently, and said, "Page speed has no relevance anymore." Oh, I haven't heard that But it's still important, right? You don't wanna make a website- I think it's super important Yeah Like, if you go to a website that takes forever to load, you d- you're like, "Come on.

Come on, man." Like- Like I'm do- I'm, I'm done I'm done ... I've lost interest. So that it, it's, um ... I say f- like ideally you're making your site as fast as it can be. Yeah. And that can be a hosting thing. It's often a code thing. Like, um, one of the reasons I don't like WordPress is that y- it can add a lot of bloat to your pages- Here we go again

that can slow it down. Here he goes again. I'm not gonna rant any further about it. But I'm just saying that like, like speed is important, right? Yeah. And so that does go back to design- User experience ... and user experience, right? Right. Exactly. Like if, if you're designing a page that is very image-heavy and has a whole bunch of like interaction, like, like transitions- Mm-hmm

and all this stuff, and you're loading in stuff behind the scenes to do it, that can take a toll on loading speed. And so, and it's- In my opinion, it's really hard to get right. It can be done right, but it takes a lot of effort and a lot of stuff to do it right. Well, and I think an easy, a low ball, a low bar is the image thing, right?

Yep. Because I know that there's been, you know, people wanna load in, like, a 65 gajillion kilobyte file as your giant photo background. Yep. Which, okay, that's fine if you're on a desktop and you're on high speed, but if you're on mobile, you, it makes no sense- Yeah ... to have that device download this gigantic file for a background where it just needs to be a small.

Yeah. So there's optimizations that need to p- take place per device, correct? Or... Yes. W- yeah, we're gonna get into that one too. Oh, okay. Um- All right. Yeah. But, I mean, there's also, like, uh, CDN servers, which is content delivery networks that deliver- Yeah. That's more for video? Or is it used for imagery as well?

It's used for most assets on your website. Okay. And the idea behind those is that you ha- there are servers that are physically closer to where you are at the time. Mm. So instead of just loading from one single server out in, you know, New York or whatever- Sri Lanka ... by getting those assets closer to you, they can be delivered just, you know, that much faster- Okay

and, and everything. But yeah, optimizing the individual assets on there. I don't know how many times I've seen images that have been uploaded to a website and just put into place without any kind of- Right ... like, um, consideration for optimizing it, like. And there's l- there's super easy things you can do to, to shave, you know, shave it down to a third of its size at a minimum.

Yeah. You know, depending on what, what the starting point is. What's a, what's a, is there a go, no-go size that's just, like, don't, d- that's j- egregious to put a 10 megabyte file as an image or something? Oh, gosh. I'll just tell you that I think, I don't, uh, honestly, I haven't looked into this because I think the, the, the answer is not, like, what's the maximum.

Yeah. It's the, i- it's how low can you get it. Okay. Right? But I think if your webpage takes more than, like, two megabytes to load the entire thing- Ah, okay. Now there's a number ... like, like, now, when you start putting in multiple images, and custom fonts, and all, and JavaScript and everything like that, that's a hard bar to hit.

Two megabytes, yeah. Um, for, especially for, uh, if you want to have more design applied to it. Cool stuff- Yeah ... on my site, right? Yeah, yeah. So, um- Flashing rainbow type, can I p- still keep that on my website? Does that- If you wanna do that, then you can do that ... does that cause more weight, though, like, if I were to do that?

Or is that- I mean, slightly more than, than... I mean, we're talking micro. What if I had a drop shadow under that type? You'd really just... We're getting back to the, um, do no harm, uh- Sorry, yeah ... point of things. Like I said, this, this is very painful to even try to visualize. I think I hurt myself. Okay. I, well, let's not go there, then.

Yeah. So I'm talking about just funny- Weird stuff, try to just limit- Yeah ... or remove it. I, I mean, I'm just... I think you need to, like, we keep talking about this, like, perfect webpage, right? Yeah. Like, ideally the perfect webpage is super lightweight and can load super fast. Yeah. And a lot of that are design considerations, there are coding considerations, and then there's also the hosting considerations and what kind of server is on it.

Is it, you know, like, GoDaddy always gets a bad name. It's b- and, but a lot of it is because, like, they sell, they sell their hosting that's on a server where they're assuming there's not a lot of traffic for your website. Yeah. And they over- they put too much, too many sites on one server- Mm-hmm ... and those can compete for resources on that one server for, for everything, right?

So hosting and moving that, like whereas if you had your own dedicated resources and everything- Mm-hmm ... that your site could load faster. And there's hundreds of different ways now. There, I'm not, I'm not even hip to half the ways- But that- ... that it works now ... that's a good point, is like, look at what you're...

Don't just choose the cheapest server hosting service out there. No. Because I know that we've run into this too, where it's like, just upgrade. Maybe you do get your own dedicated machine. Maybe it's only- Mm-hmm ... five bucks more a month or something like that. But there's, those are the type of consideration.

I'm simplifying this, so I know, but- No, no, no, totally. But this is it ... but that's what I mean, you know? It's like- Like, yeah, if you... It, uh, hosting in general, it is- You get what you pay for. Commoditized too, though. Yes. I mean, it's very... Like, the cheapest is- Yeah ... cheap. Yep. Yeah. Okay. But you'll see, you'll see that in performance and speed.

Responsive. What does that mean? Okay. So- Is that, like, somebody just responds somehow? Yeah, it's how quickly you can respond to the people who come to your website. Nice. No. Um, it is, um... When we say responsive, there's this idea of responsive design, right? Like, that you have to... The... I think the most maddening thing for a lot of people is, who create websites, is to see your website somewhere you did- that you didn't have access to before, whether it's a smaller laptop or a big screen- Mm.

Mm ... or a m- or different sized mobile phones, right? The, the perfect website should fi- should fit in all those different scenarios- Yeah ... and, and fit all the other criteria we talked about, about user experience and speed and, and everything, and, um, be able... be easy to use and get to the information that you need.

But, um, that can be hard to do. Like, that's a hard bar to, like... 'Cause you're not just designing or building for one perfect case. I know. It's like you're building at least for three. There's, like- Yeah ... tablet- Yeah ... phone, and laptop, and that... or desktop. Sorry. Yeah. Not laptop. The... Y- that's just three, but there's really...

You could cut and slice and dice that- Yeah ... even a little bit, right? Yeah. And they call them, like, break points of where- Yeah ... your design might change and everything like that. But there's... Those are not... They're, they're not set in stone. None of them are. Okay. So it's more like those are m- almost like milestones, but you need to, you need to gracefully, like- Yeah

move through those milestones, and those could be checkpoints for your, for your design. But really it should... Because you never know. You... I mean- Mm-hmm ... you could see your website up on a, you know- Jumbotron ... 42-inch TV. Yeah. You could see it on a iPhone 6 that's, you know, like- Ooh, wow. Yeah ... tiny, right? It, like...

In that... I mean, you could... I don't know if you really want to, but I mean, this is the way people get some information, right? Yeah. On, on the watch. Yeah. Like, they're... You, you- The, the idea is that you, y- it's not a one-size-fits-all thing. It's not like, it's not like designing a poster that you know the size and you know how it's gonna be shown every time.

That's was always a hard thing for me to try to understand when I was designing my two or three websites that I've designed in my life. Yeah. It's like, oh man, now I gotta do it for- Yeah ... twice over again- Yeah ... for these other things. I don't know how many times with clients I've, I've said, "Can you please send me a screenshot?

I have no idea what you're look- I, I- Oh, yeah ... can't recreate what you're seeing here." Yeah. 'Cause there's only so many, unless you wanna invest in a big old testing lab where you've got every different kind of permutation of- Well, there used to be a service- There are. There was ... I think there was- There are

where you can visualize on, like, 85 different- Yeah ... devices, right? Yeah. Yeah, and you could, you de- you definitely can do that. Yeah. That still exists and everything. But, um, luckily the web has standardized on a lot of different web interfaces, so the, the differences between them aren't nearly as bad as they were years ago.

Yeah. Um, that was hair-pulling. I probably would have more hair now- Is that where- ... if it wasn't for- Is that where it all went? Yeah, I think so. Oh. It was a lot of- Responsive ... cross-brow- cross-browser, uh, responsive website testing stuff, yeah. That's a shame. Yeah. Boy, I'm glad we're through that- Yep ... dark time.

Me too. Next three you said are? I would say that these are more, like, a lot of these things we've talked about already could a- apply to a single page website. They're all super important. I think the next three- Yeah ... are more about having a bigger site, um, and being the steward or the owner of- Mm-hmm ... that bigger site.

Okay. So with that caveat. The first would be, like, navigation. Like- Oh, yeah, if you're moving between. If you're moving, like, like, if you're moving to a bigger site, your navigat- having your navigation be clear and easy to use is super important. This goes back to the user experience. It's a part of, it's an element of user experience, right?

Right. But, like, making sure that you have, um- Clear, easy to use links, um, primary navigation, secondary navigation, or your kitchen sink down in the footer- Mm-hmm ... of your website. Um, making it, making the navigation through the site and making things easy to find is, is a very important element. It sounds easy, yet I still run into these issues to this day, and when the web's been around for decades, and we still have creators who don't understand it yet.

It, it's really interesting, and I think a lot of it is back to our overall thing, right? Right. They're kind of- they're probably building it be- to- for themselves to get something out and then move on. Ah. So they, they put a page where they think it belongs- Yeah ... not where their users might expect to see it.

Mm-hmm. Right? So, so having a navigation to, to kind of meet those people where they're at is, is a key part of user experience. I mean, it's the same, i- is there a c- to me, it's like this L shape, right? It's an upsi- or an F shape, right, that people talk about. That's u- they, they've, yeah, F or a Z or whatever, but basically, yeah, this idea that you're kind of moving left to right and then down the page.

Yeah. Yes. Along the side, the left side. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, so like most websites you'll see, they're either they got their stuff across the top or they got their stuff along the left-hand side, at least here in the left to right, you know- Yeah ... reading parts of the world. Is this one of those things where it's like don't recreate settled law?

Like, just stick with that pretty much or do, do we want to encourage people to, like, put all their nav down on the lower right? I think it depends on your website. I would say for the most part, like, what's your, w- what are you selling? Are you selling, like, crazy ideas and wild creative approaches to something?

Ah, okay. I would say, yeah, there's probably a little bit more room to, like, break from what works. Yeah. But I think for a lot of things, like leaning into people's expectations and their patterns- Right ... is gonna m- make it a better user experience for most. Second to last, here we go. Ease of updates. Now, what does that mean?

Okay. Like, ease of u- Like, I'm the owner of the website and I need to update the website. Yeah, this is where I'm, like, thinking of, like, you're the steward of this- Okay ... this website and, and everything. I need to make changes. Yeah. I think an outdated website or a site that's hard for you to update is, um, undermining this perfect- Yeah

nature of a web page, right? And so, yeah, I think it's crucial that no matter what, either you have a lifeline to somebody who can make the, make updates quickly, or better, that you know you can... You're empowered to get in there and make changes to- Yeah ... to make them quickly as, as you're, as things change.

Uh, only, the only constant in life is change, right? Well, and it, it... That's the thing is, like, comparing it to print. Like, it's printed, you're done. There's no edits. Uh, the beautiful thing about a website, it's not carved in stone. Yeah. The idea is that it's a flexible, malleable tool that your business or organization is using, and you wanna be able to keep things as updated as possible.

Yep. Let's say you moved. You don't have to change your website- No ... address, but you do have to put the new address. Yeah, that's a great example- If that's important ... of a small, small little thing that- Yeah ... you should be able to. Making it as easy as possible is, is, is part of this perfect website experience.

And please, people, I mean, if it's a local business, please put your location somewhere easy to find on the website. Yeah. That's another one that I just, drives me insane when I can't- Yep ... find that. I'm looking for your store, but you've not given me the information I need. All right. So what are some of these plat- I mean, some of these platforms are built for this.

Now, I won't bring up WordPress. We won't talk about that. Oh, it's bu- it's built for that. It's called a CMS. Yep. Content management system, which allows for the con- It's in the name, content- Yeah ... is managed. Is that something that people need to look for when they're starting off on this journey to go build their website?

It has to be a CMS, or is this something that they can, if they know code and can get in there and change HTML easily, then they can do it that way on a static site? Or... That's a fancy- insider term, I would say CMS. Like, I, like, do you need to, do you need a CMS to be able to make quick updates? I would've, five years ago, I would've said, yeah, you probably need something like it, or, or a platform like Wix or Squarespace or- Mm

something like that that allows you to log in and do those quick changes. I think now that there is... It's more technical, but I think with the rise of, you know, AI tools, Claude and everything, it is possible to have it help you make those const- those updates. Not as necessary, no, as where in the past- Yeah

you would've probably- Yeah ... wanted something. And basically what a CMS would provide in the past, I mean, it still does, but I mean back, back when they were much more, more... Maybe they're still popular, I don't know. But there's a dashboard in, on the back end of it that makes it a lot easier for a lot of different...

You don't have to be a technical genius to get in there- Yeah ... and change it. It was more like dashboard-based and very easy for anyone. There's a lot of different ways to, yeah, to get in there and not be confronted with HTML code. Yeah. Yeah. And now with Claude Code, it's not as daunting, you're saying. You, you still don't need to touch the code.

It can take care of all that stuff behind. Mm-hmm. But I would probably wanna reference the rest of our list here. Mm-hmm. Like, you can't- Mm-hmm ... like, I've seen what Claude can do on its own- Mm ... and it's not gonna touch a lot. It, it'll touch some of the bullet points we've talked about today, but it w- it's not gonna touch all of them.

So you've, it's, you're, um Handle with care, I would say. Yeah. All right, um, let's go to another one here. Search visibility. This one can get a little interesting and maybe more technical. I don't know. What is- Yeah ... what- I mean, this is like, depends on how deep you wanna go with this whole thing. Yeah. I think search visibility, I'm lumping together a whole bunch of things like search engine optimization.

I'm also lumping in like whatever you wanna call the ability for AI tools to cite your work- Right ... and everything. AEO.

Yeah, GEO. GEI. AIO. Yeah. IOU. Yeah. Yeah. Whatever. Yeah. EIEIO. EIEIO. So this is probably one of the most important issues, though, if you do have a site, is getting it cataloged by the- Yeah ... search gods. Yeah. Whoever they may be. Google. Yeah. Or the AI gods, whoever they are. Claude. Yep. ChatGPT, Perplexity, whatever it is.

But there's technical things that optimize for this, correct? I mean, and, and how hard is it to keep ahead of that? Because this is the game that is, in the past people have just been gaming this and trying, "I'm number one on Google." There, I think everyone's gonna try and still game it. The- Yeah ... the target might change.

Mm. You know, like before Google's the big dog. You know? Like I wanna rank as high as we can in Google, right? Right. It's, a lot of this is actually more of a, is probably more a copywriting thing, but it also goes back to the considering, you know- Mm-hmm ... who you're doing this for, right? What ... And this, this is really hard, because it's

You have to know what the needs are of the audience, and you have to use the words that they would be using- Yeah ... and putting into search to find you. What problems do you solve? And maybe have those actual problems outlined on your- Yeah ... site. Yeah. Yeah. So then to- So, so a lot of it comes back to copywriting.

Yeah. But you have to have an eye on what people are searching. The- Including AI on this is so, even so, so much deeper. It's always been, even for Google search and everything, the, the playbook is, yeah, you can do a lot on your own site, but what really helps is to have other sites out there. Like you're creating stuff- Mm

that's so valuable that you have other highly valuable sites linking to your stuff, and that boosts your profile- Yeah ... and the rankings and everything, right? Then there's a element of relevancy and everything. Well, AI has just exploded this beyond like backlinks. They're looking at other places to see your brand mentioned, you know?

They're looking at Reddit, they're looking at LinkedIn. They're looking at, you know, local, like Yelp reviews- Right ... and stuff like that. So, um, this is way beyond the scope of just a single webpage or something like that. Right. It's a whole thing. But if you're, if being found online in those areas like Google Search or, or AI tools is important to you, you, that has to be part of your strategy for a perfect, your perfect page.

Google- Perfect website ... ideally scores how relevant are you to solving or providing this solution. Yes. They wanna be, their goal is a question and answer site. Yes. So anything that optimizes for that- Yeah ... if you solve problems, put that on your website in as explicit of a way as you possibly can. Be a good citizen- Mm-hmm

I guess, is probably one of the easier things to do, is just be as open, honest, and forthright with all of the information about your company as possible, making it easy for them to find you- Yep ... and what you do, and that alone makes you relevant- Yeah ... on some level. Yeah. And it doesn't cost you anything- Yeah

really. Yeah. That's just to get in the door, though. It's- I mean, the game is complicated- Yeah ... at this point. Yeah. I mean, it is like you said, it's a whole- Yeah ... science that changes all the time. All the time. That's the thing that's crazy. Yeah, yeah. Um, so- The best- but the be- the foundational stuff- Yeah ... has not changed in the, you know- Yeah

my 15 years dealing with website stuff is, like, if you create easy-to-read relevant content on your page, that's your best first step. And there's a track record too, like- Mm-hmm ... being around for- Yep ... some years and some timeframe as well, just has you consistently being there and showing up- Mm-hmm ... makes you some sort of an authority in the eyes of the search gods as well.

Yep. You know, that can get you pretty far. I mean, the, the Yelp reviews and, and having those kind of things also helps if it's like a home service or something like that. Yep. All right, I have one more, Mike. One more? Yeah. We finished ease of updates. Yep. Now let's talk about integrations. This sounds complicated.

I mean, it d- it, it can be. Okay. Right? Like, um, but if you're, if you have anything other than just publishing information for people- Yeah ... right, you're probably gonna be dealing with some kind of functionality. In a lot of things out there, there are good solutions for these integrations. So great example would be, like, you have a form on your website that is a contact form, right?

Mm-hmm. Like, it seems simple, but it, but it's something that making sure that the form takes the information and then gets it to the right person reliably is, I would say that's an integration. That's a functionality thing- Yeah ... that's super important. But, um, you know, you have to keep an eye on it. It d- you know, like, the weird thing about those things is, especially if they're just sending you an email, if it's a regular contact form, you might not even notice that it's broken.

Yeah. And then- Right ... it can break, and then, then you realize- So what do you do? Like test it every month or something? Or what- I w- I mean, that's, that's something you d- that's why, that's wh- Yeah ... that's why it's an, I put it in as a consideration. Yeah. There's a whole bunch of other integrations, like integration things like if you're using an email marketing platform like MailChimp or HubSpot or something like that- Yeah

that you would, that making sure that when people sign up, that they're showing up in your list 'cause you're, you've got these other marketing- Mm-hmm ... things that you're trying to do Those integrations are something that you, you know, you need to have working and right for this, you know- Because the other thing is, is a lot of times these integrations rely on APIs.

I'll just get technical. I know maybe people don't know what an API is, but that's what the code is, basically, that's injected into your site that allows for some of these integrations to function and talk to another platform or another service like HubSpot or Mailchimp, and they get updated, and they get changed.

Mm-hmm. And they might break. Yeah. And you don't know when that happens, or maybe you do. In the good, the good ones do, um, send, you know, if there's gonna be changes that break like that. If it's something on their end- Yeah ... they're usually pretty good about that, but they can be buried in. If you're getting 200 emails a day, and you get this one thing that says- Yeah

"Hey, here's this, uh, action required thing," you're like- Mm ... "Eh, I don't know if that matches for me." And then, "Oh, shoot, it did match for what I need or for something I'm doing." So it's, um, yeah. It's, uh, integrations are, they're, they're not a part of every site, but they're super important if the- if you do have, have an ecosystem of marketing tools that are outside of just your website.

We've covered integrations, Mike. You know what? That's the last bullet point on the- Yeah ... list that you provided me for, to talk about today. It's a wonder I've stayed in this business as long as I have. A lot to keep track of. It's so much. It's kind of dizzying. Like, especially if you're trying to do it all yourself, it, it's a lot of things to consider- Yeah

and everything. 'Cause now you've built the website, you've optimized for all that stuff, and then there's the whole like, "Okay, now I've gotta keep it maintained." Yeah. "Keep it alive." Yeah. "And keep it running. And oh, then there's a change. I'm changing that photo. Okay, well, the ch- photo is gonna make it even more slower to load or something," right?

Mm-hmm. I mean, all, all those changes come with drawbacks, potentially, or risk, right? I, I mean, yeah. I- it's, yeah, I think it's just, it is, uh, there's so much. I think when you, if you're given the task of just building a web- website, and at first you're like, "Oh, yeah. I can just fire up Squarespace, and I'll build a website," or, "Or I'll set AI off and create a, create a website for me."

Mm-hmm. But, like, being aware of all these different considerations is gonna make your website better in the long run, but it's not easy. Um, it's kind of hard. But they're all things that you should be considering. Okay. Well, you've given us the roadmap and the blueprint for building a perfect website. Yeah.

I can't wait to get started. Maybe I need to come up with an idea and build one over the weekend. Yeah. Just for fun. Yeah. You make it sound like a blast. It sounds ... Yeah, I know. I'm really inspiring- ... tons of people to j- get out there. It's so easy. Just do this thing. It is. Just these tiny 12 tiny little things.

Just 12 little things. Right. Some are easy, some are not, you know? But, like, I think if you can ... If it all sounds daunting and everything like that, I think there's some things that are probably, that you could minimize the importance of and, you know, like, I wouldn't skip out on ... Sorry. I'm a perfectionist, I wouldn't skip out on most of them.

But I think if you can work on making sure that you're communicating clearly and that your design is supporting that message and not getting in the way of that message, um, and that your design is, again, not getting in the way of the communication, but also the accessibility of the website. If you can do all those things right, if you're starting from scratch and doing that, I think you're gonna

A lot of the other stuff will kind of ... y- are less important. Mm-hmm. You might not introduce more of those considerations. That's your top list. Hit that first, and then you can kinda go back- Yeah ... in- Yeah ... and help with that other stuff. Yeah. And there's some stuff that has kind of a knock-on effect, too, like the SEO part of this.

Yeah. The clearer you are, the more effective the site is, the better off it's gonna score- Yes ... in that octagon- Yes ... uh, that we like to call the internet. Yep. Um, but yeah, that's, that's good to kind of provide a preliminary list to focus on first, and then go in and backfill- Yeah. Yeah, for sure ... the rest of that stuff.

Okay. Yeah. All right. Sounds like a great place to stop. Nice job. All right. All 12. We hit it. We did it. Wow. Amazing. Yep. Thanks, Mike. Appreciate it. Thanks, Eric. It's been fun. Thanks for tuning in. For more information and other episodes, subscribe to the Marketing Team of One podcast on YouTube, Apple, or Spotify Podcast networks.

You can also chat with us on the r/marketingteamofonesubreddit or visit marketingteamofone.com to learn more.